No Love for Azog's Hunters?

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:55 am

A little late reply but it was my birthday today. Anyway,

The Ex[ert Rider rule is not particularly worthwhile but if you add that to th efact that giving a regual Captain reduces his attacks whilst Narzug never had it to startwith, plus he only cost 5pts more for extra might and fight.

Yes a Hunter Orc on Fell Warg is better than a Hunter Orc or a Fell Warg, though less reliable. The thing is for the cost, they are less worthwhile. If you have decent enough terrain like you do they should cost at least 2pts less than they do, 3pts of you don't. That said including a few of them won't hurt too much. Just never fir=eld them in large numbers. For instmnce fielding 8 costs as much as fielding 9 should. You could spend those pts elewhere, if you only have 2-4 plus loose Wargs and/or allied Warg Riders then go for it.

I still can't think of how likely it is to be able to charge a modle you can't see. If the model is behind a tree for example, all you have to do is go around it a little and you can see him. The rider's head would be able to see him.

The reason they have a 50% bow loimit, is because their archery is so terrible that noone would ever want to use them otherwise. It is akin to a trick.

whafrog · **Posted:** Wed Jan 09, 2013 3:10 am

GothmogtheWerewolf wrote:

Yes a Hunter Orc on Fell Warg is better than a Hunter Orc or a Fell Warg, though less reliable.

I'm not sure. A mounted Hunter Orc trades knockdown for have a single attack if caught when losing priority. If caught that way, they're better off on foot.

Beowulf03809 · **Posted:** Wed Jan 09, 2013 1:33 pm

If I'm right, 4 Hunters on Fell Wargs would be 64 points.
You could get 4 Hunters on foot (with their ManyBlades rule) and 4 Fell Wargs for 68pts.

With only a 4 point difference I'd rather have the 8 models, each with their own maximized special rule, in most cases.

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Thu Jan 10, 2013 1:57 am

whafrog wrote:

GothmogtheWerewolf wrote:

Yes a Hunter Orc on Fell Warg is better than a Hunter Orc or a Fell Warg, though less reliable.

I'm not sure. A mounted Hunter Orc trades knockdown for have a single attack if caught when losing priority. If caught that way, they're better off on foot.

I agree with you. That is why I said less relaible. You need luck and Might to ensure you keep the attacks. Of course if you do the striking is good, but they still cost too many pts.

Beowulf03809 wrote:

If I'm right, 4 Hunters on Fell Wargs would be 64 points.
You could get 4 Hunters on foot (with their ManyBlades rule) and 4 Fell Wargs for 68pts.

With only a 4 point difference I'd rather have the 8 models, each with their own maximized special rule, in most cases.

Again Mr Beowulf, I agreee, Hunter Orcs on foot and loose Fell Wargs, especially the former, are much better value than the combined profile. I'm just saying it is possible to use them if you really want to.

I am a firm beleiver of if you really like something, then no matter how bad it actually is you should always take it if it makes you happier whne using the army, just make sure you use it really well, and make the rest of your army in a way to compensate for it.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

well i just remember 1 way charging what they cant see.. cave fights with no light or during the night

MeatBoy1994 · **Posted:** Thu Jan 10, 2013 4:17 pm

JPRoth1980 wrote:

Howdy folks. New player here with what is probably an obvious question.

There's a lot of lists for Goblintown and such being bandied about, but in my admittedly somewhat limited research I haven't seen much about the force I seem to be drawn to. Are the Hunter Orcs subpar? Lacking in some major area? Any advice for getting started with them?

It'd be very easy to pick up EFGT and run a Goblin force, but the goblins just don't have the same visual appeal. So, basically, where should I start and what pitfalls should I avoid with Azog and his Hunters?

LOVE your avatar; Azog rules!! :-D

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:14 am

Sorry to come back here again, but this is what I think th epts values of the Warriors in the list should be:

Hunter Orc on foot: 9pts
Loose Fell Warg: as is.
Hunter Orc on Fell Warg: 14pts

This way, they are better. I hope it is okay to write pts costs that are not the real ones since GW cannot copyright pts values that do not belong to the models I have put them next to? If they have somehow managed this, just ytell me or remove.

Draugluin · **Posted:** Fri Jan 11, 2013 1:41 am

I don't see why you would make the Hunter Orcs more expensive, when compared to regular orcs, they gain 1 strength and a special rule (a great one btw), but not one that's worth 3 points, Hunter Orcs are fine the way they are. I do agree with the Hunter Orcs on Fell Wargs though.

Beowulf03809 · **Posted:** Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:11 am

The individual cost of Hunter Orcs and Fell Wargs I think were fine. It's the combo cost that's the issue. The combo should be a little less IMO.

JPRoth1980 · **Joined:** Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:48 am **Posts:** 26

So, after a little bit of soul-searching, I have settled (somewhat) on the following list. I'm a bit worried about the lack of heavy hitters, but I really do not feel like removing sufficient models for a Cave Troll, and both Azog and Bolg just feel too expensive for 500 points.

Fimbul on Fell Warg
3 Hunter Orcs on Fell Wargs with Orc Bows
3 Hunter Orcs on Fell Wargs
6 Fell Wargs

Narzug
12 Hunter Orcs

Hunter Orc Captain
12 Hunter Orcs

The bows are merely a points-eater, but I can see some limited application for them. Likewise, if the upcoming Hunter Orc character whose name escapes me is priced similarly to Fimbul and Narzug, I'll probably be fitting him in.

SidTheSloth · **Posted:** Fri Jan 11, 2013 12:43 pm

Looks good, looks very good!
with effectively 74 attacks (wow!!) on a charge it should be a pretty tough list

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

Hmm the list is surely a spicy one, alot of attacks but squishy...
I want to see how effective that list can be, I really do...

Although there is a reason why I favour orc hunters on wargs: the cavalry bonus, orcs hunters have 2A base and wargs doesnt count as cavalry so its 3A on this 2 models permanently. On a rider they do might get 4A if they win combat and knock things to the ground... I know its a bit of 50/50 on each cause its risky if the rider lose the combat, but hey for 4 A if they win combat and knock things to the ground...man !!

SouthernDunedain · **Posted:** Fri Jan 11, 2013 2:37 pm

Galanur wrote:

Although there is a reason why I favour orc hunters on wargs: the cavalry bonus, orcs hunters have 2A base and wargs doesnt count as cavalry so its 3A on this 2 models permanently.

*facepalm* someone hasnt been reading the rules properly. The many blades special rule only applies to hunter orcs on foot. So a mounted orc will only ever have 1 attack unless it charges in which case it'll have 2. (big rulebook pg 191 for ref). This is why i prefer them on foot, whatever happens, the many blades rule still applied.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

well I said I like the cavalary because I was applying the charge...
and if the rider is killed and the warg stays, that doesnt count for numbers of models killed for the army being broken when it reach half the numbers :P

-Bolg- · **Joined:** Sat Jan 05, 2013 8:45 pm **Posts:** 120

Good list, but it is 6 points to mutch, I guess you tought it costet 7 points to get a warg or you tought a warg (alone) was 8 points.
good list, I love Fimbul, He's way to strong (look at the diffrence between him en shaku on warg, 1F 1C a bow 2 special rules for on warg and a warg with a good rule, awsome)
I prefer them either on foot, I like armies with power units, becouse 8 points for 2 attacks and S4 is really good.

Lucas

JPRoth1980 · **Joined:** Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:48 am **Posts:** 26

With all due respect, check your math. Unless I am missing something (having gone over everything several times), the list works out to 500 on the nose.

Plans for expansion to 700 involve a Moria Goblin Shaman, a Cave Troll with Chain (or two), and Moria Goblins or Prowlers to fill points. I guess Azog will have to wait until I cross the 1000-point mark to make an appearance.

GothmogtheWerewolf · **Posted:** Sat Jan 12, 2013 1:03 am

You mean Yazneg? He'll probbabluy just be a genric Captain.

JPRoth1980 wrote:

3 Hunter Orcs on Fell Wargs with Orc Bows.

Sorry, but if you want to do well, you should never ever do this. If you have pts spare give the foot soldiers either bows or 2-handed wepaons. Do not give bows to your already overcosted cavalry. Mounted archers in general are very poor, and taking mtd hunter orcs with bows is absolutely terrible sorry.

JPRoth1980 · **Joined:** Fri Jan 04, 2013 4:48 am **Posts:** 26

GothmogtheWerewolf wrote:

You mean Yazneg? He'll probbabluy just be a genric Captain.

JPRoth1980 wrote:

3 Hunter Orcs on Fell Wargs with Orc Bows.

Sorry, but if you want to do well, you should never ever do this. If you have pts spare give the foot soldiers either bows or 2-handed wepaons. Do not give bows to your already overcosted cavalry. Mounted archers in general are very poor, and taking mtd hunter orcs with bows is absolutely terrible sorry.

Gah, sorry for the odd quotes--mobile. Yes, I meant Yazneg.

The bows are there for an idea, and because I don't rate two-handers at all.

SuicidalMarsbar · **Joined:** Sun Apr 24, 2011 1:14 am **Posts:** 1712

JPRoth1980 wrote:

Plans for expansion to 700 involve a Moria Goblin Shaman, a Cave Troll with Chain (or two), and Moria Goblins or Prowlers to fill points. I guess Azog will have to wait until I cross the 1000-point mark to make an appearance.

A moria goblin shaman? You do realise it's fury spell will not affect the wargs, the trolls, or the orcs? I'd recommend the gundabad shaman instead, his 'expelliamus' spell is pretty handy (as is, ofcourse, his op line of doom spell). On that note it's worth suggesting druzhag, he can buff them wargs like theres no tomorrow.

Draugluin · **Posted:** Sat Jan 12, 2013 6:22 am

I don't see how the Line of Doom is OP, you aren't likely to get off more than one hit with it. The Goblin Shaman will affect the goblins, which are the ones more likely to need it.

No Love for Azog's Hunters?

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