Saying that Sauron would've won no-matter what wouldnt be entirely accurate. Sure he might have won the WOTR but after a few thousand years of tyranny the valar wouldve showed up again and wooped saurons butt!!

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All Hail The Lord of Light, R'hllor, for the night is dark and full of terrors!

Having Glorfindel accompany them would have been a terrible Dues Ex Machina.

Also, come to think of it Boromir and Gollum are two of the most pivotal characters in the Lord of the Rings. If not for Boromir, the Fellowship would not have broken and set the various characters on the paths that brought about success. And if not for Gollum, Frodo & Sam would never have made it through Emyn Muil, the Dead Marshes and Ithilien; would not have know about the pass of Cirith Ungol and Frodo would have absconded with the Ring at the very end.

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Actually, no. They had left Middle-Earth to it's own devices. The only help that they ever sent was Glorfindel and the Istari. If they wouldn't have stopped him at the height of his power in the 2nd and 3rd ages, they definitely wouldn't do it in the 4th.

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I agree - partly.
Calling G a Deus E.M. indicates it would have been too 'simple' for him to have solved the problem, so you agree with my main argument (that G would have given the Good side a better chance of winning, despite his shininess).

However, although I agree G would have increased the chances for success, I'm not sure it would have been as easy as a D.E.M. I think Gollum would have had a much harder time 'getting involved', which at least in some reality-threads seems essential to the destruction of the Ring. I agree with you that the way things turned out (C. Ungol, etc.) required Gollum - but what of other possibilities? Could G + F&S have found a way through the Black Gate, for example?

@Drauglin: Also an interesting area of 'what ifs'... I agree they turned their backs, but had done so before and been persuaded to intervene. Would they really have done nothing if Sauron completely dominated ME? I don't know... Or if not the Valar directly, what of the Elves of Valinor? Could they have put together an Armada and invaded Evil-held Middle Earth?

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I go now to the swords and the siege,
That yet for a while rivers may run clean and birds build their nests,
Ere Night comes.

I'm pretty sure that the passage to Valinor is a one way street, so I don't think the elves could have come back. I think that the only reason why the Valar would ever return to ME is if Sauron personally assaulted Valinor (assuming he could ever actually find/open the way there), which I don't think he would ever be dumb/confident enough to do that.

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"Leave Sauron to me."
If you're in the Raleigh, NC area, let me know.

If the valar turned their backs on middle earth why send the istari to help out? I think that the valar knew that when the intervene in middle earth it causes massive damage to the land, when they attacked Morgoth Beleriand was detroyed. They only intervene at the last possible moment when all hope is lost, they never came to middle earth in the 1st age until nearly all the elves where gone and morgoth had pretty much won. So i think its fair to assume that if Sauron had won the WoTR the valar wouldve stepped in eventually seeing that there was no other choice. Eru wouldnt let his children suffer under sauron!

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All Hail The Lord of Light, R'hllor, for the night is dark and full of terrors!

You forget that they COMPLETELY removed Valinor from ME, it's not even accessable accept via magical means. They would obviously attack in Dagor Dagorath (The Battle of Battles) because they kinda have too, but I don't think they would intervene before that.

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"Leave Sauron to me."
If you're in the Raleigh, NC area, let me know.