i am about to start a goblin army and would like a bit of help on what to put in it.

at the moment i have durburz and about 30 goblins (34 if i can fix them all) from a boot fair, 12 spear, 11 shield, 11 bow

and i am going to buy a cave troll from a friend tomorrow

any ideas on what to get next, and how to turn this into a decent army

TIA

I'm no expert, but I'd suggest using Durbuz to lead warband 1, a shaman warband 2, and Groblog in warband 3. And then either take another warband, or another cave troll, choise is yours.

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Ours is the fury!

ok then, so this is my first idea.

warband 1
durburz (leader)
6 x goblin spears
5 x goblin shield
_____
115

warband 2
goblin shaman
6 x goblin spear
5 x goblin shield
____
215
warband 3
groblog
11 x goblin bow
_____
325

warband 4
goblin captain shield
cave troll, chain+spear
_____
451

warband 5
goblin shaman
______
496

not sure if it is tatally legal, but it looks ok and has huge numbers
any ideas how to improve it then.

by this i am guessing that i should try to get groblog and a shaman next, and a few captoins, time to look at ebay then

the list is legal, although I'd swap that shaman for more goblins, and you should give the number of points for each warband, not each warrior(or group of the same warriors), as otherwise people can just read the point values, and GW doesn't like that

_________________
Ours is the fury!

ok, hope that pleases games workshop then, i forgot about that as i always put in the points for each lot to help me work out the points cost of the whole army.
( you didnt see anything folks OK!!) it was all an illusion made by sauron, not me messing up a bit!

i could drop the shaman but i just dont think it would be worth it. the most warriors i could gain out of it would be by replacing it with a captain and getting 1 captain and 3 goblins for 501 pts whole army, and i'm not sure if that is any better.

I'm not realy good at looking today, I meant switching that captain for around 8 goblins, and put them, togehter with the troll, in the shaman's warband.

_________________
Ours is the fury!

oh yeah, i forgot about that, so i could gain 8 - 10 goblins maybe, i didn't spot that so cheers.

Just remember it is helpful to have a goblin drummer in a goblin army but it will take a lot away from you army

i will remember about the drum, but to be honest i wouldnt use it below 750 pts i think as it takes a huge chunk off the army, a good idea and later i might buy one, but not for my first few battles at 500pts.

with the last few changes made my army will look like this

warband 1

durburz
5 x goblin shields
6 x goblin spears

warband 2

goblin shaman
5 x goblin shields
6 x goblin spears

warband 3

groblog
11 x goblin bow

warband 4

goblin captain w shield
cave troll, chain + spear
4 x goblin shields
5 x goblin spears


so next i need some heroes and a few more warriors, i will probably look at the new paint set with the goblins as i am low on paints. anyone know what that set is like. is it worth it?

I would take away the shaman too and maybe some goblins to try to add 1-2 more trolls. They have strong def,3 attacks,6 str and their chain is insane

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éala éarendel engla beorhtast, ofer middangeard monnum sended

I disagree with just about everything that Eruntalon said. KEEP THE SHAMAN! in fact i would go further and upgrade your captain to a shaman (drop the spear and you will have the 5 points need to do this). you have Groblog, with his special rule the shamans fury becomes twice as effective (saving from a 6+ to a 5+, thus you have 2x the chance of saving a goblin)

you currently have 42 goblin warriors, if they take a total of 42 wounds, then they all die and you have 0 left, but with your upgrade fury you will have 14 guys left over. This is the same as having 56 goblins (if 56 goblins take a total of 42 wounds, then you have 14 goblins left). so as you can see, having fury is like adding goblins to your army, which is why I suggest adding in another one so all your goblins will be covered (it will take about 2 shamans to cover the number of goblins you have)

further more, i am totally against adding in more trolls, sure they have better stats, but i would much rather have 17 more goblins compared to 1 troll with a chain.
I am again in favor of taking this even further and dropping the troll and durburz (you dont need him, you have 2 shamans so you dont need his leader ship, and with the extra point you can fit in way more stuff) to add in more numbers and more firepower in the form of shelob

Groblog
5 goblins with shields
6 goblins with spears

Shaman
6 goblins with shields
6 goblins with spears

Shaman
6 goblins with shields
6 goblins with spears

Captain
11 archers

Shelob

500pts
51 models, fury (covering everything), 7 might, and a monster that will kill anything at this point level

compared to your
496pts
47 models, fury (covering half your army), 8 might, and a monster that will equal other monsters or heroes at this level (actually, it would lose more, even 70pt Rumil with spear support will easily beat a troll)


I took a 600 point goblin army to a tourny:
Druzhag
11 goblin archers
1 bat swarm

Groblog
5 Goblins with shields
6 Goblins with spears
1 Prowler

Moria goblin shaman
5 Goblins with shields
6 Goblins with spears
1 Prowler with 2 handed weapon

Moria goblin shaman
6 Goblins with shields
6 Goblins with spears

shelob

600pts
53 models 7 might
i simply swapped the captain for Druzhag, and added in some more goblins and a bat swarm
the key thing in my army is that Druzhag can use his spell to boost shelob and the bat, making them unbelievably deadly.
(in fact the only game i didnt win in the whole tourny was one in which i had a draw (against teh winner of the tourny) and i also made several huge mistakes (but i still didnt lose).

ok i was planning to keep the shaman anyway so thats cool, good idea to put 2 shamans in, but i only have the rulebook's rules for shelob as she is allied to the goblin army. is there any change in shelobs rules, and if there is, where can i find them without forking out for another sourcebook.

I dont believe there have been any changes, I just have the moria/ angmar book, along with the mini rule book. Her profile will be in the mini rule book

Nice list. However, I'd squeeze Druzhag into there, because (like you mentioned) he and Shelob make a very effective combo.

I'd also agree with your point on Cave Trolls, which really aren't that good. They're just too easy to counter and are too unreliable.

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"There are few left in Middle Earth like Aragorn, son of Arathorn." - Gandalf, Many Meetings

you cant really squeeze him in there without losing 11 goblins, or down grading all your heroes. Either way, you losing far too much for little gain (do you really need that much firepower at 500pts? its not like you will be versing aragon ). You could upgrade to the spider queen. She has less fight and str, but hers is high enough, and the extra attack, broodlings and 2 extra might (the broodlings and might make her sooooo good) make her more dangerous overall (she can chew through troops at a staggering rate). Thinking about it, Im strongly considering changing to her, as there will be less magic and archery to shut her down. The spider queen is MUCH softer, but there is far less to hurt her.

I would also like to see some experiments with Dwellers in the Dark, the high fight and movement make them quite nice, although if I knew i was going to vs a D6 army I would never consider taking one. I wonder though. If i was going to vs an army such as rohan, I would consider taking one. Despite rohans TWs, its fast movement neutralises that; add to it that rohan gets no spears, and they dont have the burst damage to kill it (they would wear it down, something which wouldnt work). Plus no spears means its easy to attack just 1 model and regain a wound

ps, if you want to use druzhag, try taking 2 bats instead, its cheaper and can get to almost any location (they are like mini dragons with druzhag) (probably best if your taking some wargs or something as well so your making the best of Druzhags high price). I havnt tried it myself, but I know how great bats + druzhag can be)

pps, Groblog, 2 shamans and a captain (with full gobs) has become the core of almost all my armies now. Durburz isnt needed because we have fury everywhere

ok, i'm not going to bother with druzhag, he seems so many points for a goblin.
good idea to have fury everywhere so thanks people!

Shaman's are a complete necessity for goblins. They NEED Fury to pass courage tests and the 1/6 chance of living is incredibly useful when you have a large horde.

_________________
"Leave Sauron to me."
If you're in the Raleigh, NC area, let me know.

actually, I dont 100% agree. Im taking Groblog, who makes goblin shamans fury work on a 5 instead of a 6. This makes it TWICE as good as before. Before if I had 48 goblins, then Id only save about 8, but with Groblog I would save about 16. Courage tests have never been a concern in the past (and present). Durburz had decent courage, enough will and might and an extra large standfast that I didnt have to worry. Before, anything under 500pts wasnt good enough (for me) to take a shaman because I wouldnt save enough goblins to make it worth while (i would save up to about 8, which is 40pts, the shaman is 45pts..), I could of just put the points into more goblins to make up the ones im going to lose. This was different over 500pts because the model cap was higher, so there were more goblins to save and because passing stand fasts was more vital (more goblins would run).

Because we have to take a bunch of heroes, using groblog and shamans only costs 40pts (we are comparing to the mimimum of 3 captains) compared to just durburz which costs 25pts extra. This means that because we are going to save about 16 troops(again, for a 4 warband army of gobs, which is average for about 500pts), we save 80pts compared to the 25pts to take it, profit! One of the benefits of shamans over durburz the 2 shamans cover everything, which means we dont need him for his courage, although you could get him as well for his might and fight.


I also like shamans over durburz because its more points efficient. If i take durburz and no shaman then im just saving 20pts to not get 2 shamans (id be taking captains), but if we take groblog instead, we only pay 15pts more, and get a big benefit: 5+ save and fearless everywhere, compared to: none of the previous, 2 might points less and 15pts less. There might be reasons to go with Durburz, you would be desperately needing the 15pts and more importantly the 2 might points, but most of the tiem this isnt the case. Even if you dont find many of my reasons relevent, Groblog + 2 shamans makes your army more reliable (less chance for things to not go as planned, ie gobins defiantly will charge a terror causer instead of possibly charging).

ok i have made an attempt to convert 12 goblins into 12 prowlers, anyway, is there any point in them. would they be worth it as they will mean i get less goblins.

also, i'm not confident of goblin shamans keeping my army together after it is broken, how do i stop this

If you cast fury, every goblin within 6in stays, there's no need to worry about them fleeing. I like Durburz because of the amount of M/W/F he has, not to mention that he has 4F. Groblog definitely looks incredibly useful.

_________________
"Leave Sauron to me."
If you're in the Raleigh, NC area, let me know.