Thoughts on changes to the existing rules/range?

polywags · **Posted:** Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:11 pm

Maybe, I think there's way to much stuff that adjusts courage I want new game mechanics I guess. I think it'd be better attached to specific models so that you can make different choices about which models you take and how you want to play but maybe stuff like the troop upgrades from heroes like Erkenbrand could be a good way to go.

Scib · **Posted:** Tue Aug 30, 2016 8:12 pm

A lot of interesting rules people are coming up with, has anyone considered putting together some new community rules packs for fun?

polywags · **Posted:** Sun Sep 04, 2016 12:26 am

What do you all think about a unit rarity guide similar to the older warhammer rules as a way to cut down on the ultra elite spams? I am not sure if I like it or not but I think ascetically it would make armies look a little nicer but I dunno if you need it or not. It would change up army compositions and builds hugely, I sorta doubt they would do it but it would be interesting.

Galanur · **Joined:** Fri Feb 24, 2012 11:28 am **Posts:** 1389

adding a limitation of a Y type of model per X type of others?

It might balance out the game overal according to army compositions...

infinateremains · **Posted:** Thu Oct 20, 2016 7:53 am

Been thinking again; this time Army of the dead. how could they improve? the king need some special rules and better stats, maybe the addition for option of a horse. A captain of the dead. the ability to be lead by Aragorn; as long as he wields Anduril, or by the three hunters all as individual warbands. Maybe an army bonus for taking only models from a set army list.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Fri Oct 21, 2016 1:41 pm

I disagree. I think the King of the Dead is basically fine as he is. What the Dead need is to cost about 2-4 points less so that they aren't so hamstrung by their other drawbacks (low fight, situational special rule etc.). If the next addition adds anything to them it ought to be a points change and a theming bonus that lets the King bring a double sized warband if you only bring warriors and riders of the Dead in your fiefdoms army or allied contingent. Like what they have for Harad but much more restrictive.

Steven bonnar · **Joined:** Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:35 pm **Posts:** 95

Wan Shi Tong wrote:

I disagree. I think the King of the Dead is basically fine as he is. What the Dead need is to cost about 2-4 points less so that they aren't so hamstrung by their other drawbacks (low fight, situational special rule etc.). If the next addition adds anything to them it ought to be a points change and a theming bonus that lets the King bring a double sized warband if you only bring warriors and riders of the Dead in your fiefdoms army or allied contingent. Like what they have for Harad but much more restrictive.

No pts drop, there balanced in there correct use vs evil forces.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Fri Oct 21, 2016 2:20 pm

You mean against orcs and trolls I suppose. Kand and Harad are unaffected for the most part. Plus, that's just assuming that the game will be a brawl through and through. The Dead on their own can't compete with anything else for board control very well.

Steven bonnar · **Joined:** Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:35 pm **Posts:** 95

Bar C6/7+ they are still better than vs D6 with there rule and there higher D as standard.
They just need a spear support from the other fiefdoms options to get that F4, etc

Dikey · **Joined:** Tue Feb 03, 2015 10:19 am **Posts:** 508

I just remembered something I really disliked in the hobbit sbg: The over abundance of fight 7 heroes. In lotr sbg, F6 was the best. It was the fight skill of the best warriors in middle earth. Only big monster or beings of great power and might were over f6 (gil-galad, glorfindel, sauron itself)
I would like to see superlegolas, bolg and their fathers down to F6.

Steven bonnar · **Joined:** Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:35 pm **Posts:** 95

Dikey wrote:

I just remembered something I really disliked in the hobbit sbg: The over abundance of fight 7 heroes. In lotr sbg, F6 was the best. It was the fight skill of the best warriors in middle earth. Only big monster or beings of great power and might were over f6 (gil-galad, glorfindel, sauron itself)
I would like to see superlegolas, bolg and their fathers down to F6.

There is talk on the nerd-vine that there all getting 1 profile but with more wargear options,
Rumours are that at least Legolas is dropping back to f6!
Don't remember hearing about the others.

Commissariat · **Posted:** Sun Oct 30, 2016 9:25 pm

It is kinda confirmed that they are reducing heroes to one profile, if the reports from the different panels with Troke have been accurate. I cannot remember about the fight value thing, but I think I recall an interview with Troke revealing that the power levels for the Hobbit SBG units is being dropped while they are making profiles for the unreleased stuff. An exception is that Mirkwood Elves are getting heavy armour, I think.

polywags · **Posted:** Sun Oct 30, 2016 11:21 pm

I really hope they do drop the hobbit stuff in power a little or what I guess I would rather is tack on new rules for older lotr stuff. I really like troops getting unique little buffs so there's more variation of playstyle from army to army instead of just having one more fight one more defense ect.

I am bummed they doing away with Thranduil's crown. I do like the idea of merging profiles but giving more options I really think Thranduil should get to keep the crown though. I know he doesn't specificlly do any magic like a natures wrath but the wood elves, and just mirkwood in general in the book is quite magically with illusions if nothing else and he has some kind of glamour concealing his dragon scars so I'd like him to at least keep the aura of dismay. I'd really like to see a different set of rules for either Thranduil or Tauriel though. It feels a little lazy they are basically the same profile with the same rule, which is also a rule shared by one of their troops.

The heavy armor for the Mirkwood elves feels kind of unnecessary honestly, the galadrim don't have it and they do look any more armored, maybe even a little less since their armor looks like its lacquered wood? If its just the Mirkwood cav guys that'd be fine, it'd be fun if they were a little sturdier.

I think a lot of the Thorin's company dwarves could use a bit of tweak down too. It kind of seems like when they were designing the Hobbit era stuff they thought the older generations of characters should be stronger like Numenor compared to Gondor, which kind of makes sense except the events of the Hobbit feel much more like people being in the right place at the right time as opposed to in LOTR where so many of those characters are legitimate war heroes. So I definitely would like to see some profiles toned down or LOTR era profiles brought up. Aragorn would smash Azog or Bolg hands down ;p But honestly I feel like even Eomer should probably be able to take down even a large orc from the earlier generations.

Steven bonnar · **Joined:** Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:35 pm **Posts:** 95

The dwarves are an exception as Durin and his folk are set further back and Gimli being younger is better than most heroes at his level for a dwarf(Dwalin!)

Coenus Scaldingus · **Joined:** Sat Aug 17, 2013 9:14 am **Posts:** 1121

Wouldn't surprise me if the Galadhrim also get heavy armour when their rules are updated (looking at the models, they should have it). Based on bits of information (or even half-formed ideas) that have been 'leaked', the revision of profiles sounds like it is going to be quite significant - and aimed at things often complained about.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Mon Oct 31, 2016 1:58 pm

I'd rather see numenor with heavy army then the Galadhrim. I mean what have they got besides a coat of mail and four small unconnected plate sections? Leather? I could see the Mirkwood guys in it because of how their chest piece looks like it might be a solid plate of metal with an overlay.

Halin · **Joined:** Tue Oct 18, 2016 5:41 pm **Posts:** 19

polywags wrote:

What do you all think about a unit rarity guide similar to the older warhammer rules as a way to cut down on the ultra elite spams? I am not sure if I like it or not but I think ascetically it would make armies look a little nicer but I dunno if you need it or not. It would change up army compositions and builds hugely, I sorta doubt they would do it but it would be interesting.

I thought about that as well. I think you could just introduce a tag "Elite".

Elite would simply mean that you can have only 3 of them in one warband, means 3 normal troups grant 1 place for an elite model. I'm thinking of stuff like Berserkers, Feral Uruks, Iron Guard especially.

I could even see some independent hero models pushed into this range, Dunedain and Rangers of the North for example. Them having might/will/fate would not be a huge problem I'd say. I'd argue a presedence has already been set in this regard with the King's Champion, the banner bearers specifically, who have two fate each and are non-heroes as far as I'm aware as single units.

Maybe even some upgrades could push a unit from normal to elite, which would be interesting I think.

polywags · **Posted:** Tue Nov 01, 2016 9:18 pm

Coenus Scaldingus wrote:

Wouldn't surprise me if the Galadhrim also get heavy armour when their rules are updated (looking at the models, they should have it). Based on bits of information (or even half-formed ideas) that have been 'leaked', the revision of profiles sounds like it is going to be quite significant - and aimed at things often complained about.

Interesting. I guess that makes sense. Its kind of interesting though for the elves to be so lightly armored. The option would be nice though, and of course fluff wise it does feel a little silly that elven armor isn't super strong and well made. I would rather see elves get the option to upgrade str somehow. Elven blades, going two handed, are just so bad when compared to any of the other factions upgraded killing power. Especially with the new dwarves it would be nice if they could maybe wound them :p Similarly though, fluff wise, when the elven swords Thorin, Gandalf and bilbo get are the best swords they can get but the average elf can barely would a goblin with shield :/ I guess you could just as easily go the other way though, and address the power creep in defense.

Steven bonnar · **Joined:** Wed Jul 27, 2016 8:35 pm **Posts:** 95

Mirkwood elves are rumoured to have heavy armour as part of the next rules release end of this month start of December!

As for an elite tax, we already have a warrior tax with the warband requiring heroes to lead them,
To add additional restrictions to army composition beyond every unit option being viable could force certain forces to disappear from use completely!
Or the fact most people wouldn't adopt it due to the hard earned cash and time spent getting them models built and painted!

Ukfreddybear · **Posted:** Sun Nov 06, 2016 1:40 pm

Galanur wrote:

Give the armies faction special rule like some mentioned....
Maybe to invest people playing single lore armies? like a faction overall without much mixing... or just the special rule applies if you have a majority of the army % in question...

Special rules like.... (this special rules only apply if at least 50% of the army is made up of that faction and each go kinda lore wise depending to which faction in question).

Noldor´s Lineage (Eregion/Rivendell warriors automatically pass courage tests if the´re within 12" of an Eregion/Rivendell heroe, in addition Eregion/Rivendell warriors and Captains re-roll shooting rolls and duel rolls of 1s as long the´re in base contact with eachothers in groups of 6 or more)

Forth Eorlingas! (Rohan Warriors re-roll courage test rolls of 1 if the´re within 12" of a Rohan Heroe, in addition, all mounted Rohan warriors and Captains re-roll wound rolls of 1 the turn they charge).

Ancient Numenor (Numenor Warriors gain +1 to the Courage roll if the´re within 12" of a Numenor Heroe, in addition Numenor Warriors and Numenor Captains gain +1 to their fight value as long the´re in base contact with eachothers in groups of 6 or more)

Move or you´ll feel the lash(Mordor Warriors gain +1 to the Courage roll if the´re within 12" of a Mordor Heroe, in addition Mordor Warriors and Captains Fury roll gain +1 to the result as long the´re in base contact with eachothers in groups of 10 or more, however if by any reason a model rolls a 1 of the Fury roll, that model suffers a wound)

Hosts of the Woodland Realm (Mirkwood Warriors automatically pass courage tests if the´re within 12" of a Mirkwood Heroe, in addition Mirkwood Warriors and Captains re-roll rolls of 1s both in duel and to wound rolls as long the´re in base contact with eachothers in groups of 6s or more)

These are some examples that came up....

I can confirm that Army bonuses are indeed coming in the new book. But only if the entire army is from the same list.

Thoughts on changes to the existing rules/range?

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