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Bolg or Azog?
http://wwww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=24946		 Page 1 of 1
Author:  Rabid Bunny [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:53 am ]
Post subject:  Bolg or Azog?
I've been thinking about using one of these two in my games, but i'm stumped as to what one would be better.

Azog: A melee beatstick. With the White Warg, he seems like he'd be mean, knockdown and 3+ to wound enemy heroes is pretty brutal (also, would his two handed weapon stack with the 3+ to wound?),but its a pricey combination.

Bolg: Another melee beatstick. Tougher than Azog, but he gains buffs from killing enemy infantry, which he is very good at.

I'm personally leaning towards Azog as I tend to have problems putting down enemy heroes like Aragon or Boromir. The Hunter Orcs seem pretty good at killing basic models, which makes Bolg a bit redundant.
Author:  Jazlotus [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 3:04 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
Try one in one game and then try one in the next game and report back to us all! Both look real good. But at the points amount they cost, they wanna be good.
Author:  JPRoth1980 [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 10:46 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
The way I see it, Bolg wants to go kill 10 warriors then start going after heroes. Azog is a torpedo to send into your opponent's best heroes from the beginning.

Bolg eventually becomes better than Azog, but it requires the full 10 kills. And yes, I would assume that a 3+ to wound stacks with an ability that lets you add one to the number you roll to wound.

If you take Azog, though, definitely take his White Warg. Another 3 might and will are just well worth 50 points.
Author:  GothmogtheWerewolf [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 12:56 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
The White Warg's Might pts can only be used by the White Warg not Azog, so for example, Azog must use his own to modify. I don't even think the Warg can use his Might or Will unless seperated from Azog.

Of course Azog on White Warg is better than Bolg, but the pts cost is more which makes it more even, the question is whether Azog on foot is better than Bolg, and that is different, you either take Azog mtd if you have the pts, or just take Bolg.
Author:  Galanur [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 1:30 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
Im really curious about that white warg might stuff because if its 50pts without using them, its an expensive model for defence 5 and 2 wounds but if he can fight even on mounted or use his might/will/fate table might seems more worthy the points.
Author:  Rabid Bunny [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
GothmogtheWerewolf wrote:
The White Warg's Might pts can only be used by the White Warg not Azog, so for example, Azog must use his own to modify. I don't even think the Warg can use his Might or Will unless seperated from Azog.


I think the White Warg is mainly for its knockdown effect initially, it can be dismounted and do its own thing once Azog has taken down any opposing enemy heroes that regular Orcs can't deal with.

I've got a few other lists to try out, it might be a week or so before I can try out any Azog's Hunter's lists.
Author:  GothmogtheWerewolf [ Mon Jan 21, 2013 2:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
Rabid Bunny wrote:
I think the White Warg is mainly for its knockdown effect initially, it can be dismounted and do its own thing once Azog has taken down any opposing enemy heroes that regular Orcs can't deal with.


This is exactly it. Hence no point in taking lance either. First use Warga s an ordinary Mount then split them into 2 heroes (unless 1 or both die before you split of course)
Author:  Beowulf03809 [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 5:17 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
It's an interesting situation with the "hero" mount. I don't know of any other precedence for it in SBG. Considering the rule of thumb for all other situations is that you may elect to use any or all of a mount's profile in a fight, I wonder if it might hold true here as well?

For example: Use the Warg's Fate if he's hit while still mounted. Use his Might to call an Heroic Combat while Azog's still mounted (assuming there's nothing in his profile saying he can't call HC).

Of course, if you can't tap his MWF while he's serving as a Mount, I imagine you can at least use them to modify the roll to stay on the table when the dismount does occur.
Author:  GothmogtheWerewolf [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:06 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
I think you cna use the Fate, if they are striking at the Warg and not Azog, but Might and Will no.

Gwaihir ised to be a mount and he had M/W/F, but I don't know much about those old rules.
Author:  Draugluin [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:28 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
Beowulf03809 wrote:
It's an interesting situation with the "hero" mount. I don't know of any other precedence for it in SBG. Considering the rule of thumb for all other situations is that you may elect to use any or all of a mount's profile in a fight, I wonder if it might hold true here as well?

For example: Use the Warg's Fate if he's hit while still mounted. Use his Might to call an Heroic Combat while Azog's still mounted (assuming there's nothing in his profile saying he can't call HC).

Of course, if you can't tap his MWF while he's serving as a Mount, I imagine you can at least use them to modify the roll to stay on the table when the dismount does occur.


I know that a rider can spend Will for his mount, so it follows that it goes both ways. Since a Nazgul can spend might to modify a to wound roll for his Fell Beast, it follows that the White Warg can spend might for Azog. However, neither can use the others Fate. I personally am going to use them as a hero hunter to take out the baddest heros in the enemy army, then once they're gone, split them up to butcher some warriors. The thing about Azog is that he doesn't have the potential of Bolg. Terror would have been a nice addition to his profile.
Author:  Jazlotus [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 9:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
The rider or the mount can use might to resist spells
Author:  Jazlotus [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:07 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
As the rider and mount are counted as one piece, surely they can both use there M/W/F whilst together.
Author:  Draugluin [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:08 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
They can't use each others Fate, but they can use Might and Will.
Author:  Jazlotus [ Tue Jan 22, 2013 10:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
Draugluin wrote:
They can't use each others Fate, but they can use Might and Will.

What page number is that from?
Author:  GothmogtheWerewolf [ Wed Jan 23, 2013 12:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
Well, I'm sure it says somewhere that a mounted hero's fate can only be used on himslef not his mount, since the fate belongs to him (or her) alone. The same would apply if the mount did so.

Fate represents eaxh hero's ability to survive no matter what, whereas might points are for heroic deeds. Leading other troops to acts of valour is still a heroic deed, but the hero has no supernatural control over the resilience of others, unless they are Malbeth or a Shaman. Will points should really be the same as fate not Might, but alas.
Author:  Draugluin [ Wed Jan 23, 2013 1:22 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
As Gothmog said, but the Will kinda makes sense, if a rider bonds enough with his steed, they would share a sort of magical connection, allowing them to use each others Will.
Author:  Jazlotus [ Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:32 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
I found the page reference where it says both can resist magic. Just can't find anywhere in the book that says what Gothmog says.
Author:  Jazlotus [ Wed Jan 23, 2013 9:37 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Bolg or Azog?
The hobbit book says that because the rider and Mount are one, the can use Might, and later I read to resist magic you can either use the will of the rider or mount. Just can't see where it says what you said Gothmog about Fate?
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