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| Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls http://wwww.one-ring.co.uk/viewtopic.php?f=37&t=23551 |
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| Author: | Raggbur [ Thu Aug 02, 2012 3:16 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
Hi Everyone, Something I enormously enjoy about Wargames in general, is the metagame: occupying yourself creating a balanced list in your head. Now because I've been playing a lot of 40k (a game where your list is 75% of the game) the past 2 years, I have been enjoying myself a lot with building what I call Library Lists. You'll all know what I'm talking about ones I explain it: these are very thematic lists, centered around a specific idea. More than that, the point is also to make them fairly competitive. (40k) Ideas could be: a list to best represent actual space marines (like in the fluff), a 100% genestealer list, a list using only land speeders & storm ravens (in 5th ed, mind you), a space wolves list with only 3-man squads (and almost no vehicles),... Now, since I'm getting back into lotr ones again, my mind is constantly wandering of & creating Library Lists for SBG... So, what else can I do then type them out & show them. The first is centred around a frustration I have since GW ever released the Harad scourcebook: why the hell do Half-Trolls come from Harad?! Last time I checked, the Troll population in Harad was zero to none (which makes sense, considering the sun). So how did the half-trolls get there? And why aren't there, according to GW, no half-trolls in regions like Mordor, The Misty Mountains, Dol Guldor, Angmar,... Places that are crowded with Trolls and 'hybrid' creatures (Half-orcs,...) So, because I'm a servant of the Barad-Dûr first & foremost, I wanted to created a list that contained a lot of Half-Trolls, and very little Harad... Most Library Lists I come up with are developed at the different pt levels, but because this list fitted so nicely at 500pts: Warband 1 Mahud Tribesmaster 10 Half-Trolls Warband 2 Shadow Lord, or The Dark Marshal / Knight of Umbar 10 Orcs with Spears Morannon Orc Banner Bearer Morannon Orc with Shield TOTAL = 500pts First of all: I think that, if this list is nicely painted up in a fitting dark colourscheme, it's gonna look awsome (DMS... No?) But concerning gameplay: this is a list build towards my fanaticism for symmetry & ranks. The Half-Trolls form a nice arrowhead, supported by the spears. At the top of the arrow comes the nazgûl, with a morannon orc in front of him in case someone decides for a lucky shot. I'd go with the shadow lord in case some elves decide they wanna throw 6's, but I can see that the Dark Marshal would allow for some genious combat boosts. The Knight of Umbar also, perhaps, for some anti-F5+ And of course we add in a Banner. When you'd really want to bump this list to higher point levels (while keeping the theme of course), getting 12 Trolls/Spears would be nice. Perhaps some scouts on wargs (I know, haradrim are better, but stickin to the theme here) for some bow fire. What would be awsome to add is of course a Mordor Troll, perhaps even with a war drum (imagine the look of the army then). What do you guys think of this list? Does it work? Or am I still in a more 40k mindset? Anything you might change, keeping the theme in mind? Post! K |
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| Author: | GothmogtheWerewolf [ Thu Aug 02, 2012 4:15 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
From the Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (book) Book 5 Chapter 6: "... and out of Far Harad black men like half-trolls with white eyes and red tongues" p. 828 Half Trolls of Far Harad are these guys - from the book - canon, unlike the rest of the Mahud). The Half trolls aren't actually meant to be half troll, but there are hill trolls to the very south of Far Harad. No other half trolls are mentioned by Tolkien I think. As for your list, it would be themewise okay for the Black Gate battle, and a load of Half Trolls is genrally a strong list. Swap the Morannons inc. Banner for a Fell Beast. |
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| Author: | Draugluin [ Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:32 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
Half trolls aren't actually half trolls, they're just Far Harad tribesmen like the real world African tribes that have warriors who are VERY big. If you hadn't ever seen a black guy, but had seen a troll, you're first reaction to Shaq would probably be to think that he's a half troll (no offense meant to anyone, btw). |
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| Author: | GothmogtheWerewolf [ Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:42 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
Draugluin wrote: Half trolls aren't actually half trolls, they're just Far Harad tribesmen like the real world African tribes that have warriors who are VERY big. If you hadn't ever seen a black guy, but had seen a troll, you're first reaction to Shaq would probably be to think that he's a half troll (no offense meant to anyone, btw). +1 as I said 
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| Author: | Raggbur [ Thu Aug 02, 2012 5:44 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
Damn, Gothmog, you're right, forgotten al about that line (I knew it though)! And Drauglin is probably right, it's all seen through xenofobic hobbit eyes after all... Though Gothmog, do you mean adding the fell beast when going up in pts ? Btw, isn't a banner necessary in the new scenario 1 ? |
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| Author: | GothmogtheWerewolf [ Thu Aug 02, 2012 11:06 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
Well if you're at 800pts or 1,000pts or something, you would need a Fell Beast but what I meant was, drop the banner and other Morannon Orc and use the pts to give your named Wraith a Fell Beast. So the list would look something like: WB 1: Mahud Tribemaster 10 Half trolls WB2: Named Wraith w/ fell beast 10 orcs w/ spears. Banners are not necessary, but it does help, just make sure you kill the enemy's banner. Also, iyt is still illegal the write the pts value of a single model (groups are fine) so remove the pts cost of the Tribe Master and the Ringwraith. (and from the Morannons if you keep them). |
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| Author: | Raggbur [ Fri Aug 03, 2012 7:10 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
Oh yeah, guess that's true, I'll edit it. But why would you really want to get a fell beast in there? They're good, but the army in general is already quite elite & lacking bow fire. |
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| Author: | Ares B [ Fri Aug 03, 2012 8:07 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
GothmogtheWerewolf wrote: From the Lord of the Rings: The Return of the King (book) Book 5 Chapter 6: "... and out of Far Harad black men like half-trolls with white eyes and red tongues" p. 828 Half Trolls of Far Harad are these guys - from the book - canon, unlike the rest of the Mahud). The Half trolls aren't actually meant to be half troll, but there are hill trolls to the very south of Far Harad. No other half trolls are mentioned by Tolkien I think. Tolkien mentions troll-men also later: "...East rode the knights of Dol Amroth driving the enemy before them: troll-men and Variags and orcs that hated the sunlight." But after a quick googling it seems this thing is like the Balrog wings: some are certain there were half-trolls, others are vehement that there weren't. |
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| Author: | Draugluin [ Fri Aug 03, 2012 2:24 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
On the case of Balrog wings, they were definitely there. Whether they could be used to fly is another matter. On the case of Troll-men and Half-trolls, they were definitely there. Whether they actually were partially trolls is another matter. |
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| Author: | GothmogtheWerewolf [ Fri Aug 03, 2012 11:40 pm ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
If Balrogs have wings they cannot fly. Half Trolls did exist, whether literarally or not. A Ringwraith is never elite enough without a Fell Beast unless you need 8 extra models or something, but all you need to do is remove a couple. Fell Beasts are generally worth it nowadays. |
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| Author: | Draugluin [ Sat Aug 04, 2012 2:32 am ] |
| Post subject: | Re: Raggburs Lotr Library Lists – Mordor Half-Trolls |
As a Maiar, they could defintely grow wings if they wanted to, but I think at most they could just be used as a jump boost of sorts. |
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