Could the dwarves defeat Smaug?

Johnnie · **Joined:** Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:14 pm **Posts:** 87

What if Thorin had the Arkenstone, would he together with the 7 (?) Dwarven kingdoms armies defeat Smaug in battle?

Isilduhrr · **Posted:** Wed Oct 29, 2014 12:38 pm

judging by the last 10 minutes of DOS, they could hammer him into the ground without a might point spent.

General Elessar · **Posted:** Wed Oct 29, 2014 12:55 pm

I'm not sure the Arkenstone is actually an offensive weapon, or indeed any kind of weapon at all.

In answer to your question, Bard could do it with a bow. I suppose one of them might get lucky if they all aimed for the hole in his coat.

Éomund · **Posted:** Wed Oct 29, 2014 1:24 pm

Well according to the films the arkenstone is a sign for being the rightfull king and the other dwarves will obey if you have it. So indeed not really a weapon.

But i think this was only made up by jackson as i cant remember it from the book. In the book it was only very important for thorin.

And i guess they wont kill him. If he was in real danger he could always just fly away.

Dr Grant · **Joined:** Fri Aug 03, 2012 1:50 pm **Posts:** 1339

The film changes to the Arkenstone are IMO probably the single best change the film-makers made and one that often gets ignored/unpraised by the fans. In one deft piece of film-making they manage to utterly explain and justify the dwarven plan and the need for a burglar in a way that the book never does. The plot of the film (13 dwarves and a Hobbit Burglar heading to Erebor) makes so much more sense when you realise that (in the film) they're only trying to sneak in and steal the Arkenstone rather than (in the book) break in and somehow take back Erebor without the slightest resemblance of a plan and yet 'needing' a burglar.

That one gets a big well done to the scriptwriters from me :yay:

Johnnie · **Joined:** Sun Dec 23, 2012 9:14 pm **Posts:** 87

Haha! Never meant the Arkenstone as a weapon on its own :-D

What I meant was if Thorin had it and united the dwarven kingdoms and marched for Erebor too defeat Smaug in battle as Gandalf told Thorin at Bree. Wouldn't Smaug just burn all the dwarves?

Erunion · **Posted:** Wed Oct 29, 2014 3:40 pm

Dr Grant wrote:

The film changes to the Arkenstone are IMO probably the single best change the film-makers made and one that often gets ignored/unpraised by the fans. In one deft piece of film-making they manage to utterly explain and justify the dwarven plan and the need for a burglar in a way that the book never does. The plot of the film (13 dwarves and a Hobbit Burglar heading to Erebor) makes so much more sense when you realise that (in the film) they're only trying to sneak in and steal the Arkenstone rather than (in the book) break in and somehow take back Erebor without the slightest resemblance of a plan and yet 'needing' a burglar.

That one gets a big well done to the scriptwriters from me :yay:

Agreed. It does make much more sense this way. For all the things PJ gets wrong, this addition is good work.

Wan Shi Tong · **Posted:** Thu Oct 30, 2014 1:33 pm

No I don't think the dwarves could have ousted Smaug from the mountain even with an army and short of collapsing part of it on him I doubt they could have killed him either. The plan to raise an army to fight Smaug was pretty stupid and it really colored by opinion on the whole trilogy. What were they going to do ask the dragon to come out and fight them on an open field? He'd have roasted them to crisps. Were they going to open the main gate and flush him out? No, they'd have walked right into a meat grinded. Just think what a flame thrower or a machine gun can do to a company of men in a straight, coverless corridor. Marching a spit and polish army up against a thing like Smaug would have been tantamount to suicide. That's why in the book the dwarves just planned to steal thing, and every they meet figured they would steal thing too. No one, aside from Gandolf, had hopes the dragon would die as a result.

Could the dwarves defeat Smaug?

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