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Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
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Author:  Raspberrygoop [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 8:59 pm ]
Post subject:  Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Hello from Wellington, New Zealand; home of The Hobbit.
It's currently 9:30am on December the second, so I've had the Escape from Goblin Town boxset for almost 24 hours.

A quick word on the updated rules, feel free to add anything I miss.
I won't go over the brand new rules, just ones that are updated.

Updated Rules
Unarmed models can now strike blows, albeit with reduced effectiveness.

Elven Blades have a new rule to differentiate them from Two-handed weapons. Elven blades may only be used as a hand weapon if you also wish to use a shield's DEF bonus.

Spears now contribute one attack at the Fight and Strength of the wielder of the spear. You can spear support two-handed weapons, but not those who are Shielding.

Pike blocks now require both rows to wield pikes.

Hand weapons and two-handed weapons have a number of Special Strikes they can make.

Hammers, maces and mauls can Bash
Daggers and swords can Feint.
Axes and picks can Piercing Strike
Clubs and staves can Stun
Flails, scourges and whips can Whirl.

Throwing spears are now distinct from other throwing weapons. They have greater range.

The Ring has a new set of rules that make the bearer more deadly.

Due to the introduction of Heroic Channeling, Magic Powers have been updated. A few new Magic powers have been added to the universal list. All powers now have a regular effect and a more powerful Channeled effect. Some magic (Blinding Light, Command/Compel, Immobilise/Transfix) has been nerfed, with their old versions being their new Channeled versions.

Also worth noting that Games Workshop have stopped encouraging Metric units for moving and shooting, everything in measured in inches. ):
This is due to certain distance formulas (such as how far monsters Hurl their foes) working out to full inches.

It's worth noting that the rulebook that comes with the Goblin Town boxset does not include any profiles for the new Hobbit miniatures. The intro booklet includes the profiles (minus points costs) for all the models in that boxset. So if you wish to field Hunter Orcs, or the three Trolls, or just want to know the points costs for Thorin's lads, then you'll need to shell out and buy the large rulebook. A book that you already mostly have.

Any questions?
Author:  Draugluin [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:53 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
I just copied down the pt values of each of the models in the box. The guy at my GW store was ok with it.
Author:  hithero [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 10:58 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Quote:
Unarmed models can now strike blows, albeit with reduced effectiveness.

Elven Blades have a new rule to differentiate them from Two-handed weapons. Elven blades may only be used as a hand weapon if you also wish to use a shield's DEF bonus.

No change there as elves have hand weapons as well as elven blade.

With all this added detail and no extra profiles, I don't think that The Hobbit rules actually replace the LOTR rules as they would be almost unusable in larger games and have no point values, looks like the box game is meant to be a stand alone skirmish/roleplay game and only that. Also the GW Throne of Skulls event will be using the LOTR rules.
Author:  Draugluin [ Sat Dec 01, 2012 11:19 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
The rules fully supercede the old ones, it's just that the small rulebook doesn't have any profiles. The big one has all the rules for TH minis, including ones not in this release and gives the warband rules as well.
Author:  Dezartfox [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:20 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
hithero wrote:

With all this added detail and no extra profiles, I don't think that The Hobbit rules actually replace the LOTR rules as they would be almost unusable in larger games and have no point values, looks like the box game is meant to be a stand alone skirmish/roleplay game and only that. Also the GW Throne of Skulls event will be using the LOTR rules.


Incorrect, the Hobbit rules replace the Lotr rules:
http://www.games-workshop.com/gws/wnt/b ... 200046-gws

"One of the questions I was asked was "Is The Hobbit: An Unexpected Journey a complete reboot of the Strategy Battle Game?" My answer was short and sweet - yes, absolutely, it's the latest edition of the rules for the Strategy Battle Game."
Author:  whafrog [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:38 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
So far I like the new rules and the elven blade tweak. One might wonder when it would come into play, but if you feint with your blade, you might suffer enough on the Fight score to now equal your opponent, in which case the blade still gives you an advantage if you tie the Duel roll.
Author:  Draugluin [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 12:45 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Amdur suddenly has a pretty good advantage against Aragorn or any other F6 hero thanks to his Elven blade.
Author:  Sticky Fingersss [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 3:28 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Why no longer the metric system???
Author:  whafrog [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 6:05 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Sticky Fingersss wrote:
Why no longer the metric system???


I'm actually glad about that, though I live in a metric country. The game was designed in inches, and IMHO it plays differently and better in inches.
Author:  SouthernDunedain [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:12 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
I like all the new rules bar the one that gives any model that moves -1 to it shoot value if it wishes to fire a bow or use a throwing weapon.
Author:  KhazadAi-menu [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:52 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
I haven't got the new rule book yet, however I suspect that it may be one of my Christmas presents. but concerning the new ruling on the -1 to throwing weapons: if you throw the weapon and then move do you suffer the penalty also? Or only of you throw at the end of the movement phase?

Also, have GW really made it so that I have to buy the main rulebook as well as the box game if I want the points cost of the individual models in the goblin town box? Because that's a hell of a lot of money to shell out just so that I can field individual models in thorins company.
Author:  lordgoober [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 7:54 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
One thing I like is that bow volleys are now gone. No more of the sitting back and shelling forces with arrows from way far away. Yet another nail in the coffin of the old grey company.

Oh yeah, they did. This douchebaggery of this is the straw that has finally broken my camel's back with this company. Outside of the next WFB Dwarf book whenever it comes (WFB dwarves are my main army there), I am DONE buying GW at retail now after buying the box set and the rulebook here. Had this been a Journeybook at say the $40 price point I wouldn't be this annoyed.
Author:  Raspberrygoop [ Sun Dec 02, 2012 10:26 am ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Quote:
I like all the new rules bar the one that gives any model that moves -1 to it shoot value if it wishes to fire a bow or use a throwing weapon.


Oh, thank for pointing that out. I totally missed it.

Quote:
One thing I like is that bow volleys are now gone. No more of the sitting back and shelling forces with arrows from way far away. Yet another nail in the coffin of the old grey company.


Also that. Man, some things I just take for granted.

Quote:
Also, have GW really made it so that I have to buy the main rulebook as well as the box game if I want the points cost of the individual models in the goblin town box?


I'm not exactly poor, and I don't mind paying a lot of money for quality products, but I draw the line at people trying to sell me things that I already have. $165NZD is simply too much, considering that I already own most of the book. If you charge me less, I promise I'll spend the difference on models!
Author:  kidterminal [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:03 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Raspberrygoop wrote:
Quote:
I like all the new rules bar the one that gives any model that moves -1 to it shoot value if it wishes to fire a bow or use a throwing weapon.


Oh, thank for pointing that out. I totally missed it.

Quote:
One thing I like is that bow volleys are now gone. No more of the sitting back and shelling forces with arrows from way far away. Yet another nail in the coffin of the old grey company.


Also that. Man, some things I just take for granted.

Quote:
Also, have GW really made it so that I have to buy the main rulebook as well as the box game if I want the points cost of the individual models in the goblin town box?


I'm not exactly poor, and I don't mind paying a lot of money for quality products, but I draw the line at people trying to sell me things that I already have. $165NZD is simply too much, considering that I already own most of the book. If you charge me less, I promise I'll spend the difference on models!

The big book has other profiles of miniatures to be released down the line. There are no points values listed in the big book.
Author:  whafrog [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:12 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
KhazadAi-menu wrote:
if you throw the weapon and then move do you suffer the penalty also? Or only of you throw at the end of the movement phase?


You can only throw in the move phase if you're charging. In theory, if you were 1" or less away from the model you are charging (because of, say, fight resolutions and backing away in the previous turn), then you could throw before moving, but that's the only time.
Author:  Beowulf03809 [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 6:15 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Wow...volley fire is gone completely? That doesn't but me too bad w/ my Elves as they have always been so much more effective direct fire, but volley was a nice option for weak+cheap Orc bows, especially facing mounted forces.
Author:  BrentS [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:18 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
kidterminal wrote:
The big book has other profiles of miniatures to be released down the line. There are no points values listed in the big book.


My emphasis in Bold. Surely that isn't true? The Big Rule book has points for all the models, right??
Author:  SidTheSloth [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:22 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
If anyone is wanting the points values they can be found on this army builder 8)
Author:  Lorizael [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 7:48 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Yes there are points values in the big rule book.

And no, you don't have to buy both the box for the small book as well as the big hardback book.
If you get Goblin Town/small book, you just wait (a probably short time) for the source book which covers the models.
Just the same as all Warhammer & Warhammer 40,000 players have done for years. In comparison it was a luxury having profiles/points costs in the old rule book.
Author:  Fëanor, the mighty elf [ Mon Dec 03, 2012 8:10 pm ]
Post subject:  Re: Thoughts on the updated rules in Hobbit SBG.
Lorizael wrote:
If you get Goblin Town/small book, you just wait (a probably short time) for the source book which covers the models.
Just the same as all Warhammer & Warhammer 40,000 players have done for years. In comparison it was a luxury having profiles/points costs in the old rule book.

We don't know if such a sourcebook will be released. As far as we know now, the only way to obtain the stats for the Trolls, Hunter Orcs etc is by buying the big book.
Back in the days, the FotR/TTT/RotK starter sets included all the rules for the models in the game. Sure, now we've had a massive expansion of the warriors and heroes, but at least giving the full rules for the models in the set isn't too much to ask, is it? It's not like the

Anyway, let's stay on topic.
I guess like some of the changes in the new rules, and I hate some too. But what is more important is how they can just change a lot of rules and not modify any points values. Surely the Grey Company isn't as strong as it was before! And this happens while all Monsters get a major boost (though not going up in points). How will this not effect balance? :roll:
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